re: The Pledge of Allegiance

Quoting Beth [due 12-25-08]:“ I find it damaging to have a child blindly pledging their "allegiance" to something. If they don't understand ... [snip!] ... to your country etc then go for it. I know everyone's saying they didn't have to say it, but in all of my schools here we did.”

Agreed. It almost seems like indoctrination (actually, that's EXACTLY what it is, but I'm trying to give the benefit of the doubt, heh) to have children recite something like that by rote without having an understanding of what it is they are saying.

C.

Quoting Mrs. C:“ I think that Under God definately needs to be removed from the pledge and our money. We are obviously ... [snip!] ... really see it as hurting or helping anything. I stopped saying it in the 10th grade but mostly because of the under god thing.”

I think it would be most correct to say that the U.S.A. is one nation under Money.

heh (except I'm not joking)

C.

Quoting Milo'smom:“ I understand where you're coming from, but much of our society has been adapted to fit the atheist/agnostic ... [snip!] ... of choice whether or not you wish to partake in that part of american culture that does not streamline with a lack of belief.”

Because it's not agnosticism or atheism that is driving this, it's secularism, which is different. A person can be religious and still be secular.

C.

Quoting Milo'smom:“ I disagree. At the Sea-Tac airport in Seattle WA, they were sued and forced to take down ALL Christmas ... [snip!] ... (aka the plege), just to satisfy those that wish to have any semblance of a god completely wiped out of this country?”

Why do you automatically assume that's the motivation? Is it not possible that other religious groups might be upset about not having equal representation?

It's always those pernicious atheists at fault...

C.

Quoting cherrya03:“ Then instead of God say what you want then and if you dont beleive in anything then dont say anything, ... [snip!] ... do what we need to adjust but take something completely out cause one group doesnt like it isnt fair to the group that does.”

Even if the group that wants it is discriminatory?

C.

Quoting Milo'smom:“ I know a lot of people who aren't Christians who are uncomfortable with the notion of gay marriage. Those ... [snip!] ... Obviously not all aspects of science, but some do take far reaching grasps at hypotheses and pronounce them as gospel.”

Anyone who pronounces science as gospel isn't a scientist, and thus shouldn't be listened to on the subject.

No serious scientist would ever equate science with something as dogmatic and inflexible as a religion.

C.

Quoting Milo'smom:“ But do you see what I'm saying about the theory of evolution being taught in schools as absolute truth ... [snip!] ... if some scientists fess up that it is actually a "religion"? There are still a lot of things that have no concrete proof.”

Schools do not teach that evolution is absolute truth, because the concept of absolute truth is by it's very nature UNscientific.

Schools teach that based upon the tools that we currently have and the information we currently have, as humans, that this is what we theorize to be true about the origin and history of the Earth.

C.

Quoting Milo'smom:“ Right. I am fine with it being taught as a scientific theory, and I do believe that evolution to some ... [snip!] ... this subject should largely remain untouched until people wish to seek it out in college or sunday school class or whatever.”

It's more than just a "theory", though. What they teach in schools is "this is what we've been able to observe in our laboratories, and what we've observed is what leads us to make these conclusions". They teach the science, they don't just teach "well uh, we think this is what happened, but we don't have any evidence to give you". What is so wrong with teaching students, for example, "This is a fossil. It was found here. Testing with this instrument seems to indicate that this fossil is X years old. Because of this, we theorize that X was found in this area X years ago"?

C.

Quoting It's a Hovey-Craft:“ Nowhere in there does it say that is was specificallyfor the children's magazine, all it saysis; ... [snip!] ... of the popular children's magazine The Youth's Companion as part of the National Public-School Celebration of Columbus Day.”

Right.. for Columbus Day... Not the founding of the U.S.A.

C.

Quoting CatLuvr83:“ and sometimes he'd be in retrograde...don't you hate those days?  ”

Yes, yes I do.

C.

Quoting God:“ It's more than just a "theory", though. What they teach in schools is "this is what we've been able ... [snip!] ... seems to indicate that this fossil is X years old. Because of this, we theorize that X was found in this area X years ago"? C.”

I totally agree with that. If something has evidence and validity there is no reason it should not be taught in school. I just think that there are large gaps in the theory of evolution (in the case of humans evolving from one cell organisms) that cannot be proven because they were never directly observed. I agree that there is obviously evolution happening all the time with every species all around us. If you don't evolve, you die. I just don't think that it's 100% infalliable as a theory for how humans came to be.

P.S. Did anyone else get nervous in school when you had to read aloud in science, that you would accidentally say "orgasm" instead of "organism" ? Or did I just have an unhealthy sexual fixation?

Quoting Milo'smom:“ I totally agree with that. If something has evidence and validity there is no reason it should not be ... [snip!] ... in science, that you would accidentally say "orgasm" instead of "organism" ? Or did I just have an unhealthy sexual fixation?”

lol. People used to do that all the time in school. How embarassing.

Quoting Milo'smom:“ I totally agree with that. If something has evidence and validity there is no reason it should not be ... [snip!] ... in science, that you would accidentally say "orgasm" instead of "organism" ? Or did I just have an unhealthy sexual fixation?”

lol. No, can't say that I had that problem, though I did once accidentally say condom when I was trying to say condominium... my Dad got a good laugh over that one.

C.

Glad I'm not the only one! I used to speed read ahead just so I could find the word organism so I would be good and ready for the correct pronunciation when I got there! I also gave my mom's friend a good laugh when I told her my uncle just bought a really nice condom in Hawaii. I must have been about 11 or so. I can't wait till my kids start making me laugh my head off!

Quoting Mrs. C:“ Obviously I am playing catch up here. I am personally so sick of Christians fighting to put God ... [snip!] ... about them? I see no Budda statue displayed at airports or city halls. Everyone has rights and everyone should be respected!”

Yep - if I remember correctly, this country was actually founded because of the desire to escape religious persecution..

I'll also just say, while it isn't making me butt-hurt or anything, I just see a lot of stereotyping when it comes to talking about Christians. Guess I just don't find that terribly fair..