Quoting Mara:" also, maybe i know nothing about these laws - i'm just spouting what i've heard in D&D on this issues before. perhaps he IS discriminating and it's against the law? "

As a previous business owner myself, I think that if that state does protect homosexuality from discrimination (and it seems Oregon does) that he isn't legally within his rights. I know for sure we would have had no legal standing to deny service to anyone based on race, gender or religion & would have been open to lawsuit....so since Oregon protects homosexuality in with those other categories, I don't actually think he has that right in his state.

Quoting Mylittleone's (B.B.M):" I am familiar with them I also know she has no case for he would serve her a cake for any other event ... [snip!] ... him through the mud as much as she wants would could work against her for he could counter sue for declamation of character :-)"

I guess we will all have to wait & see where the courts end up falling on this one as I do not think it is as absolute as you do & I am very curious to see what the findings will be. I think the fact that he won't make her a wedding cake specifically makes it more obvious that it is discrimination.

Quoting TheNuge:" From a legal standpoint, you may be right UNLESS the courts believe that moral or religious objection ... [snip!] ... BTW, i cant stand our "protected classes" system any more. It has gone too far. In some areas it makes sense but not in others."

Clergy fall under separation of church & state - even in the area of services they provide. A JOP falls under the jurisdiction of the state in regards to discrimination, so they can deny ONE couple they do not want to marry in particular, but they can't have a "no interfaith" (or no interracial or whatever) marriage policy. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/10/15/interracial-couple-denied_n_322784.html
THIS JOP was put in a position where he ended up resigning over the race one & rightfully so.

<blockquote><b>Quoting Mylittleone's (B.B.M):</b>" I am familiar with them I also know she has no case for he would serve her a cake for any other event ... [snip!] ... him through the mud as much as she wants would could work against her for he could counter sue for declamation of character :-)"</blockquote>



Anyone with a business degree took classes on business law and business ethics. For my HR management degree, I took several. It by no means makes me an expert.

There are multiple instances where commercial businesses such as photographers, dress makers, and venues have declined to host services for same sex weddings or commitment ceremonies. In the vast majority, they have sided with the plaintiff. If a business says they will not provide services or a specific service for a gay couple that they would provide for a straight couple, they are admitting to discrimination under current laws and the Oregon equality act. Unfortunately, laws protecting religious beliefs focus on what services are offered, not who those services are offered to. There is a very big difference.

Quoting Bangtail:" <blockquote><b>Quoting Mylittleone's (B.B.M):</b>" I am familiar with them I also ... [snip!] ... religious beliefs focus on what services are offered, not who those services are offered to. There is a very big difference."

For business law it said specifically that a business owner would have to refuse all services to a certain group of people for it to be deemed discrimination she had been going there for a while with no issues and he would have made her other cakes or baked goods just not for this venue so it is not seen as discrimination and if he does not have a track record of doing this it will not count as well because it was a one-time offense. I am not claiming to be an expert but the book is pretty straight forward on this and so were my teachers who just used this in our on-line discussion assignment.

Quoting Mylittleone's (B.B.M):" For business law it said specifically that a business owner would have to refuse all services to a ... [snip!] ... the book is pretty straight forward on this and so were my teachers who just used this in our on-line discussion assignment."

OR maybe he didn't know she was a lesbian before now so he didn't get a chance to turn her down before. It's not like I discuss my sexual orientation with my cookie maker. So is he saying he will bake cookies for the lesbian support group meetings?

is he a douchebag? most likely.

can he do this? sure.

So there's nothing to discuss here. His bakery, his choices.

Quoting ♥ inês:" is he a douchebag? most likely. can he do this? sure. So there's nothing to discuss here. His bakery, his choices."

Thanks for showing up 6 pages in & informing us there is nothing to discuss.  

He is being investigated by the Oregon Dept of Justice for this allegation, so I don't think it's quite time to say there is "nothing to discuss" when there has been no legal determination made. Maybe you ought to call the ODJ & let them know you have it all figured out & save them some time & money. ;)
http://www.kmvt.com/news/regional/OR-Bakery-Under-Investigation-189537681.html

Quoting justanothamotha:" Thanks for showing up 6 pages in & informing us there is nothing to discuss.   He is being ... [snip!] ... out & save them some time & money. ;) http://www.kmvt.com/news/regional/OR-Bakery-Under-Investigation-189537681.html"

HIS bakery, HIS choices. Is it wrong? Yes, it is.. But he gets to choose, it's not like he harmed anyone. Seriously, why so much drama? they could easily just go to the bakery next door. People aren't always going to respect us for what we are, so let's just move on.

There are cases of greater importance to deal with.

The protected class issue is so aggravating to me.
A business owner should be able to determine who/what events they wish to be a part of. If they refuse to provide a wedding service for any reason, they should be allowed. Participating in wedding is different from selling them a cookie or catering their backyard barbecue.
I hope the bakery owner wins the case.
No couple should be able to win a lawsuit if someone objects to their union.

Quoting TheNuge:" The protected class issue is so aggravating to me. A business owner should be able to detainee who/what ... [snip!] ... barbecue. I hope the bakery owner wins the case. No couple should be able to win a lawsuit as someone objects to their union."

   

Quoting ♥ inês:" HIS bakery, HIS choices. Is it wrong? Yes, it is.. But he gets to choose, it's not like he harmed anyone. ... [snip!] ... aren't always going to respect us for what we are, so let's just move on. There are cases of greater importance to deal with."

I would be willing to bet he is shut down because of this

I DO believe that gay people should have the right to get married
I Do NOT believe in god or religion
that being said the shop owner is religious and it goes against his beliefs for same sex couples to get married in his books he could possible go to hell for being part of an unholy union. he said he would serve them anything else just not a wedding cake!
i think its wrong that people think like this but i also understand why he wouldnt serve them and i think based on religious grounds he shouldn't have to serve them, as stupid as it is.

I believe sexual orientation should be federally protected the same as gender, race, and religion are, soooo no I don't believe he was right nor was he within his rights.

Quoting TheNuge:" The protected class issue is so aggravating to me. A business owner should be able to determine who/what ... [snip!] ... barbecue. I hope the bakery owner wins the case. No couple should be able to win a lawsuit if someone objects to their union."

Making a cake for a wedding is not participating in the wedding. I have made wedding cakes, I have helped arrange flowers, I have done lots of things over the years to help people get things together for their wedding. It is a service if you are being paid for it - not an invitation to participate or any symbolic measure of giving it your blessing. People who make wedding dresses aren't saying the person wearing it should get married or that they have picked a good partner or that you even have to be a virgin to wear white. They are dress makers. Same with cake makers. I can't see how it is different to order a cake for your wedding or for your anniversary or for a birthday other than the size & detail & price of the cake. I am not asking someone to participate in my birthday when I order a birthday cake from them & to claim otherwise is an enormous stretch.