re: Do they understand why? CIO question

<blockquote><b>Quoting Mama❍Moon:</b>" I am at least going to try it. It worked for my first, progressively yes, but not for my second (way too intense, all the time!)... so we'll just have to wait and see how it goes. "</blockquote>



Every kid is different and so is every parent. I have friends whose son absolutely refused to sleep through the night until he was two. Every time he'd cry, they'd rush to get him and he knew he could use that. Eventually they got tired of it and let him CIO. They'd start by going in every ten minutes or so to soothe him, then 30, and so on. Within two weeks, he loved his bed. I never co-slept, but I had a sleep fighter.

Quoting Lisa Holdridge:" There's a few good techniques to try. I followed Gina Ford's contented little baby routine from the ... [snip!] ... a week but once you've cracked it you will be much happier and have your bed back instead of that 1/8 that lo leaves you lol!!"

It's just different when you have a child like my son. I just refused to let him scream hysterically. I mean if I would have waited 10 minutes he would have most likely thrown up, he got that crazy. Going in to soothe him made it escalate quicker, he was even bloody one night after a few minutes of flailing around, he whaked his nose on the crib somehow, I just couldn't do it. SoI just gave him the time he needed and eventually, with weaning also, he stopped night waking and started going to bed awake and calm.
My daughter, what a breeze compared to my son. Her crying usually never became more than a fuss. And if she woke at night we would just have to tell her to go back to sleep from our bed and she would!! Maybe because she was so easy, my son seemed like such a nightmare!

Quoting Lisa Holdridge:" There's a few good techniques to try. I followed Gina Ford's contented little baby routine from the ... [snip!] ... a week but once you've cracked it you will be much happier and have your bed back instead of that 1/8 that lo leaves you lol!!"

Does gina ford use a parent led schedule? Is that the woman you mean?

Quoting Chim Richalds:" Does gina ford use a parent led schedule? Is that the woman you mean?"

Yes I guess that's what you call it. It's a schedule of feeding times and sleep times.

Quoting Lisa Holdridge:" Yes I guess that's what you call it. It's a schedule of feeding times and sleep times."

There is all sorts of controversy about that book blatantly disregarding world health organization guidelines, the author has no formal credentials. Babies need to be fed on demand.

Quoting Chim Richalds:" There is all sorts of controversy about that book blatantly disregarding world health organization guidelines, the author has no formal credentials. Babies need to be fed on demand."

There's all sorts of controversy about lots of things generally from people who don't know the full picture. It worked for us and my babies never went without feeding. It's impossible to not feed a hungry baby. The woman has worked with babies for a very long time and experience can be as valuable as certificates she doesn't prescribe or diagnose medications. There is not one page on any of her books that tells you to withold feeds but you would know that if you had read any of them.

<blockquote><b>Quoting Mama❍Moon:</b>" Just curious, do you think a child can understand say at 8 months or so that you want them to go to sleep ... [snip!] ... WHY. And I think that is where a lot of the stress comes from and why some parents choose not to push it. What do you think?"</blockquote>




They probably don't get it.
At some point, if more gentle methods of putting babies to sleep doesn't work, CIO MAY be a useful tool.
It worked for us after lots of lots of trying and lots and lots of sleep deprivation.

Quoting Mama❍Moon:" Just curious, do you think a child can understand say at 8 months or so that you want them to go to sleep ... [snip!] ... WHY. And I think that is where a lot of the stress comes from and why some parents choose not to push it. What do you think?"

absolutely not.

they're SO far from language comprehension at that point. it's all baser animal instinct.

being away from mama/papa = anxious baby...

Quoting MommaSav2:" <blockquote><b>Quoting Mama❍Moon:</b>" What about a 2 year old... or at what ... [snip!] ... older but she just isn't ready yet. My son was ready to transition at 13 months. He was fine. All children are different."

Totally not trying to butt in - just offer what worked for us. i slept with my kid sin their room for a few nights, then stayed with them until they were asleep a few more nights, etc. I never tried to put them in their own room & leave until they were good with the next step & for us that took a couple of weeks. Dh & I also agree dthat once w estarted to move in that direction, there was no backtracking...sooooooo if that meant I had to sleep in that room for 6 months, then I was sleeping there 6 months, but we weren't going to come back to the family bed. Our thinking was that going back & forth was more anxiety producing & kind of validating a fear than it would be for me to stay until they acclimated. And even now, if someone needs something at night, we go to them, not the other way around. Neither has slept in our bed since moving out. We both have had time sw eslept with them, particularly for illness. We also have a futon in our room & when we have longer visitors like gramma they sleep on that in our room & when she leaves, they go right back to their room without a problem. Anyway - ti is what has worked for us & I have been very happy with how well it went & how easily...so hopefully ANY of that is helpful to you. ;)


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As for the OP we don't do CIO. I don't think any kid can understand why their emotional needs are no longer being met. Even a 2 yr old might understand what you are telling them to do, but that doesn't mean they feel confident or capable to do it nor understand WHY you give a crap where they sleep. I also think that sometimes parents will say they can tell a child is just angry...as if we all don't know that anger comes from sadness, fear or frustration. Any psychology 101 class will tell you that. I just dont' see why it is only one wya or the other - either the kids sleep with you forever OR you have to do CIO. I just think people skip a huge area in the middle that is peaceful & respectful to all involved. And if I was ever planning to do CIO, the last thing I'd do is let my baby in my bed. The idea that baby would be forced straight from cuddling you in bed into their own bed in their own room & made to CIO is beyond cruel to me. It is just not necessary.

I think 8 months is too young to understand. As far as 2 years old, it depends on the child.
I let my daughter CIO at 2. I was sick of getting up 4 times a night to rock her back to sleep. The final straw was when she came back from her dad's after a weekend and I rocked her for over an hour before she stopped fighting, and then she woke up 45 minutes later- it was past midnight by then. I found out she had been up past midnight. So basically I had to hard reset her sleep schedule. It took 2-3 nights, checking on her after 2 minutes, then 5, 10, 15. Checking on her made her scream where she was only whining before, so I did it less, and checked in on the baby monitor to make sure she wasn't hysterical. Now she sleeps 12 hours at night and takes a 2-3 hour nap. I co-slept with her for a year out of necessity- long story, lol.
The boys have been in their own bed since day one. They will not fall asleep without fussing a little-I don't get it, but if I try to help, they cry, but if I don't bother them, they fuss for maybe 10 minutes and are asleep. It's weird.

Babies need to learn how to send themselves to sleep. It's much better them learning themselves than doing everything for them. Sometimes you need to leave them. What if you have a colicky baby they won't settle if you're holding them or they're in the cot, sometimes you need to put them down and go into a different room for a minute to help your stress levels. Everything a child does is learned you have to train them. If you keep going to them everytime they cry that is what they will expect, you're setting a rod for your own back. No matter what those people who don't agree with CIO say it is not feasible to have a baby or a small child attached to you all the time. As a parent you know if you're baby is in distress and sometimes they are crying just because they are not getting what they want. As long as they are secure in the knowledge that you won't let them go without the things they actually need you need to set a standard. The longer you leave them in your bed the longer it takes to get them out of it, same as a dummy or a comforter or anything else like that. If you train them from the beginning to go in their own room, and let's face it there's no medical evidence that says they shouldn't, a child can die of SIDS in the same room or bed as their parent, then why make it difficult for both of you down the line. Perhaps it does help a bit with night waking but that's only for the first couple of months. They don't have any concept of anything for the first couple of weeks then it just becomes the norm. Obviously some people have no choice because they don't have the space but I would much rather them be in their own room. I'll be doing the same thing with this one when she finally arrives. You get a much better rest time when you do get some sleep because you have your own space. You are not a terrible Mum because you let your baby cry. You are a terrible Mum if you hurt your baby, or don't feed it or don't ever pick it up. There's nothing wrong with CIO if you are trying to teach them something as important as sleeping in their own room and are not being delibrately cruel. It's an important lesson in life.

Quoting Lisa Holdridge:" Babies need to learn how to send themselves to sleep. It's much better them learning themselves than ... [snip!] ... something as important as sleeping in their own room and are not being delibrately cruel. It's an important lesson in life."

I just completely disagree. I don't think you teach someone how to fall asleep. Just like you don't teach them to crawl or walk or talk. They learn to do these things over time & with life.

I had a baby with colic. I had a sling. Both my kids are super independent now at almost 6 & almost 3. I set no rod for my back like you like to assume. They slept with me until whenever, they nursed until whenever the younger one still nurses. I worked outside the home until my older one was almost 3, that wasn't a problem either.

And yes, there is medical evidence that does say they should not go into their own room right away. It's called doubling the risk of SIDS. So if your child is twice as likely to die in the 1st 6 months of life if in their own room, how is that not medical evidence?

You do not have to parent for conveinence & force a child to deal with it OR have a difficult child. Quite the opposite. My kids will put themselves to bed now very easily...even in the middle of the holidays when we were having a party & other kids were still running around. I told them it was time to go, they said their good nights & good byes cheerfully & went off to bed. When I finally got a chance to run up about 5-10 mins later to kiss them goodnight they were both already asleep. What was that you said about a rod?

And FYI - Ferber, the man who made up the method even says it should not be done with infants under 6 months & can damage their bond with adults. If you actually wanted to know the truth there is a ton of research in the field of human development that does say this is detrimental to human development & it goes against the way humans have been parented (and babies have been wired to be parented) since the dawn of time. Never before in human history would a mom have placed her vulnerable infant away from herself at night. It would be a stupid thing to do as it would leave the baby very open to being eaten or harmed at night. So tell yourself whatever you want - it isn't the best thing for newborns at all - in fact they cant' regulate breathing, body temp or heart rhythms nearly as well when apart from mom. That is also all measurable & studied.

Quoting justanothamotha:" I just completely disagree. I don't think you teach someone how to fall asleep. Just like you don't ... [snip!] ... regulate breathing, body temp or heart rhythms nearly as well when apart from mom. That is also all measurable & studied. "

aaaand thanks for replying for me!

perfectly stated.